Why do you come to the forums to post, read the topics, and what other people post? Do you come to post your opinion, to discuss the topic, or to debate the topics? Do you come merely to see what other people have to say? Do you come to ask questions of other people so that you can learn a different viewpoint? Do you come to make people feel badly for their opinions? Do you come for the 'drama'? Do you hope to see drama? Do you come to try to change their minds or are you genuinely curious about what other people think?? Do you come specifically to pick an argument with people or make snide comments to people who disagree with you? Do you come to simply express your opinion and talk to other Bloopers about a common topic? Do you like to find out what everyone else in the community, especially those who aren't your friends on the site, think about something? Do you think that everyone should have the same opinions on things? If everyone had the same opinions on everything, what would the purpose of the forums be? What would the world be like if everyone thought the same? Do you like talking with people who think just like you and agree with you, or do you like talking to people who have differing opinions, and why?

Rationale for asking this question: the vaccination thread caused some extremely hurt feelings in some people [one of whom I consider a friend] and I realized that this person sees the forums in a completely different way than I see the forums, and I wanted to know what the rest of the community thinks about the forums.

Please feel free to answer as many or as few questions as you wish.

My answers: I genuinely want to know what other people think about things. I like to post my opinion about things and sometimes discuss or debate the topics. I consider this a place where we can talk to many other people about the same topic. I don't consider it a place where we all come to make other people feel bad. I consider it a discussion, where different ideas and beliefs and thoughts are thrown around [often with sources and research to back up those claims, especially if they are fact-based and not simply 'belief' opinion [if you understand the difference]. In my mind, it is like a meeting of the minds where we can all say what we think and discuss and debate an issue. Everyone has a different opinion, and if they want to discuss their opinion with people who disagree [or if they like to debate] then this is a good place to come to do that. I like to know what other people think and I have an open mind on everything. I like to try to open people's minds to a different point of view to make them understand where I am coming from and see it from another perspective without necessarily changing their minds. If we all were the same, if we all thought the same, if we all believed the same, then the world would not be interesting. Who would want to carry on a conversation with someone who agrees with everything that they say? How interesting would that be?

Why do you come to the forums to post, read the topics, and what other people post? Do you come to post your opinion, to discuss the topic, or to debate the topics? Depends on the topic. Sometimes to discuss, other times to debate, sometimes just to find out more about people from other countries and cultures.
Do you come to ask questions of other people so that you can learn a different viewpoint? Yes, sometimes. For example, I asked many questions in the vaccine forum of those who choose not to vaccinate. Because I can't personally understand why you would do that, and I was curious to know what brought others to that decision. Some answered politely and explained their reasons sensibly. Others took it as great offence and wouldn't answer any questions (although to me this is a sign of someone who isn't actually that confident in their decision to start with, and their reasons for it).
Do you come to make people feel badly for their opinions? No.
Do you come for the 'drama'? Sometimes. ;) It's entertaining to see the nonsense that some people come up with sometimes.
Do you hope to see drama? No. It's not necessary. But sometimes it's just a bonus.
Do you come to try to change their minds or are you genuinely curious about what other people think?? Not try to CHANGE their mind... but rather try to find out WHY they think like they do, and make suggestions as to alternative points of view, which may be worth considering.
Do you come specifically to pick an argument with people or make snide comments to people who disagree with you? Rarely. I try to remain polite (and for the most part I believe I did so in the vaccination forum). When others become rude however, that is a different story.
Do you like to find out what everyone else in the community, especially those who aren't your friends on the site, think about something? Yes.
Do you think that everyone should have the same opinions on things? Of course not. And the forums would be very dull then.
Do you like talking with people who think just like you and agree with you, or do you like talking to people who have differing opinions, and why? It's way more fun (and more challenging) talking to people who disagree. I think I've already explained my reasons.

I did actually once change someone's view though. Years ago someone posted some very ignorant comments about eating disorders. I wrote an entry in response which ended up RC, on eating disorders, and explained they were an illness. This person at first got extremely angry and rude with me, but it prompted him to do his own reading and he realised how wrong he was, and he later came back to me and apologised. That was years ago though.

1. Boredom.
2. Entertainment/amusement.
3. To learn things.
4. To read others' perspectives.
5. To give input/help/advice.
6. To clarify things (in terms of Bloop rules, UA, etc.).
7. To form an opinion on a topic I'm not too familiar with (and to read as many opinions as I can before forming my own).

I come for the drama.

Why do you come to the forums to post, read the topics, and what other people post? Do you come to post your opinion, to discuss the topic, or to debate the topics?
I come on here to read mainly, I've posted a few news topics, but other than that, I'm just here to read and see what people have to say about certain topics and to hear peoples opinions on some issues. Sometimes I try and voice my opinion, but I'm always very open minded about what other people have to say.

Do you come to ask questions of other people so that you can learn a different viewpoint?
I try to. I think being able to discuss certain things is a way of making a less ignorant world. I think sometimes people do raise good points and opinions and it's interesting to see how other people think and feel about a range of different topics.

Do you come to make people feel badly for their opinions?
I don't do it intentionally. It's very hard to, discuss your opinion without making someone else feel bad about their opinion or whatever. I don't attack a person, I never attack what they have to say or attack them outright, but I do question people about their opinions and also try and provide my own opinion. I dislike it very much when people attack people and get completely off topic.

Do you come for the 'drama'?
I don't like it personally, but It just seems to be a way of bloop life these days. I don't willingly search it out or try and cause any, but it's hard not to notice it occuring. Because it does occur.

Do you hope to see drama?
No, like I said, I don't search it out and I don't wish to cause any or add fuel to the fire, but it's there.

Do you come to try to change their minds or are you genuinely curious about what other people think?
I never try and force my beliefs or opinions on other people, but I do try and make the world less ignorant and at least give people another way of thinking. It's just like, when I read other peoples opinions and beliefs, I try and take in as much information as I can (so long as it's not out right dumb and stupid), It's interesting to hear other peoples thoughts and opinions. But no one will every FORCE their opinions on me, just like I won't force my opinions on them!

Do you come specifically to pick an argument with people or make snide comments to people who disagree with you?
No. I said earlier, I don't attack a person outright, but I may question their beliefs. If a person disagrees with me, good for them, it means they have a functional brain for themselves. I like it when people can think and feel for themselves, don't be a sheep!

Do you like to find out what everyone else in the community, especially those who aren't your friends on the site, think about something?
Yes, its good to get a range of views.

Do you think that everyone should have the same opinions on things?
Certain things, yes (Like all the evil things in the world, like murder and so forth), but generally speaking; no. I don't think everyone should agree, like I said earlier, people need to use their brains for themselves, don't be sheep, think and feel for yourself, make your own mind up about topics. Makes a less ignorant world :)

Do you like talking with people who think just like you and agree with you, or do you like talking to people who have differing opinions, and why?
I don't like it when everyone agrees with me, it makes me wonder if their lights are on upstairs. The last thing I need is someone agreeing to EVERYTHING I say. I have one friend in particular, we don't agree on one topic in particular, but I commend her on that, she may not agree with me and I may not agree with her, but it just means we are two individuals with two different ways of thinking, it doesn't make her any less of a friend.

Why do you come to the forums to post, read the topics, and what other people post? Do you come to post your opinion, to discuss the topic, or to debate the topics?
debating bores me, so i don't usually look for it. no one's really good at it here anyway. it's more "THIS IS WHAT AND I THINK AND THAT MAKES IT A FUCKING FACT". uh, no thanks. i usually read something amusing that catches my eye.

Do you come to ask questions of other people so that you can learn a different viewpoint?
sometimes.

Do you come to make people feel badly for their opinions?
it's hard to make someone feel bad for their opinion, so no.

Do you come for the 'drama'?
yeha i do. it's pretty damn funny sometimes.

Do you hope to see drama?
no.

Do you come to try to change their minds or are you genuinely curious about what other people think?
it's also pretty difficult to change someone's mind, but i do get curious about why some people think the things they do.

Do you come specifically to pick an argument with people or make snide comments to people who disagree with you?
oh god do i ever just feel like doing that. most of the time i can behave myself.

Do you like to find out what everyone else in the community, especially those who aren't your friends on the site, think about something?
yeah.

Do you think that everyone should have the same opinions on things?
i guess about certain things, like "killing babies is wrong", but about more mundane stuff, no. it'd be a boring place then.

Do you like talking with people who think just like you and agree with you, or do you like talking to people who have differing opinions, and why?
either really.

I just come here because I'm bored. There's no agenda other than that for me.

I come for the News thread mostly. Sometimes to see that other people's opinions are on a topic. Sometimes for a laugh at the people who think they know everything about everything & sometimes just to interact with different people. I like talking to people with the same opinion as me & people with a differing opinion, it's fun to learn about the other side of things, and also to learn about others reasonings behind it.

Boredum, most of it doesnt interest me at all. I prefer the funny ones than the serious crap thats on here. Dislike the "drama". I just keep away from it because it generally is a waste of time.

Why do you come to the forums to post, read the topics, and what other people post? I come often out of boredom, or if a title catches my eye. I read, I sometimes post if I have something worth saying or if I feel like just saying something even if it has not point.
Do you come to post your opinion, to discuss the topic, or to debate the topics? All. I will post my opinion if it's asked for, or if it is different and I feel my opinion should/could be stated. Some topics I happily discuss on. And if someone wants to dispute my opinion then sure, I'll debate a topic. I don't come for the one specific thing
Do you come merely to see what other people have to say? No. Sure, I will see what they have to say, but it's not my only reason for browsing the forums
Do you come to ask questions of other people so that you can learn a different viewpoint? Sure. Sometimes it's nice to get a different viewpoint, or the 'other side' of an argument. Especially if I'm sitting on the fence about something.
Do you come to make people feel badly for their opinions? No. But if I think someones opinion is utterly insane (like those who felt sorry for that stupid ex-blooper who fed her kid faeces), then I'm happy to tell them I think they're a twat too.
Do you come for the 'drama'? Do you hope to see drama? I admit, I love a bit of drama. I think it just spices things up a bit. I also think people idea's of drama are different. What some people see as "drama", others may see as a slight bit of banter and nothing more.
Do you come to try to change their minds or are you genuinely curious about what other people think?? I'm curious as to what others might think. And I'll state what I think, and if that changes their mind, great. If not... I'll live an I don't particularly care.
Do you come specifically to pick an argument with people or make snide comments to people who disagree with you? No. I don't intentionally pick arguments. I have/do make snide remarks to some people when they're being dickheads, but I don't come specifically to do that.
Do you come to simply express your opinion and talk to other Bloopers about a common topic? Yes
Do you like to find out what everyone else in the community, especially those who aren't your friends on the site, think about something? Sure. Some things. Not all things.
Do you think that everyone should have the same opinions on things? No
If everyone had the same opinions on everything, what would the purpose of the forums be? Discussion. People who have the same opinions are perfectly capable of holding discussion.
What would the world be like if everyone thought the same? Probably a much happier place, tho a bit boring ;)
Do you like talking with people who think just like you and agree with you, or do you like talking to people who have differing opinions, and why? Both. I like to know I'm not alone in the world with my way of thinking. But sometimes I like a bit of a healthy debate.

Yeah I usually come here if I am bored. I just like reading other people's opinions, and I sometimes come here for help with something if I can't find an answer on google. I like reading bloop drama, because it's always so entertaining. I never get into the drama personally though, because I don't like arguing with people on here. I don't mind debating and passing around ideas and stuff like that, but people are usually too close minded to do that in a mature manner. I also like reading the news people post on here, there are some strange ones that I probably wouldn't have found out about myself, and the reactions to the news is interesting as well.

Oh and you stated about someone getting extremely hurt feelings over the vaccination topic. My advice to them is to either ignore, or not read them. And if they want to let a bunch of people online upset them based on their choices then maybe they need to widen their horizons and get in to the real world a little more. And if they are that upset about it, are they really that set in their belief? It shouldn't matter to people if others do not agree with their opinion.

Those are my thoughts exactly. Some people think that if you disagree then you are attacking them. This particular person was very upset that people disagreed and they wanted 'sources' for her information, which she did not provide, saying how could she remember every book she'd read in the past 10 years.

And there are times when we can't provide sources - such as when we experience something first hand. Nothing can prove what our life experience is, but in that case, we wouldn't say "all my research" and "I've done research on this" which prompts people to ask for the research.

Experiences do count for something, and it's interesting usually to hear others experiences. However, as you've just said, experience is not research, and it's not evidence.

And I do think if you're going to claim to have done your 'research' on a topic such as vaccines such that it has led you to believe them to be dangerous then you should surely at least be able to (a) demonstrate an understanding of the basics, such as the principle of herd immunity, and an understanding of the components within the vaccine (which this girl couldn't) and (b) be able to provide some sources to help others understand how you came to such a decision. I don't think anyone asked her to produce every book she's read in the past 10 years, but if she's become SO convinced that vaccines are dangerous, it should surely be easy for her to provide some sort of evidence to back up the decision (she couldn't provide ANY. Except for one newspaper article on the flu vaccine, which is hardly an example of good evidence) to put her kids at risk of deadly diseases. If she's not able to do that, then I would say it suggests she HASN'T done her research at all.

And, if she's SO sure her decision is the right one, why is she so upset when someone questions her? For example, if someone asked me to explain why I believe vaccines to be safe I could quite easily do that. I could quite easily produce the evidence that says vaccines (and their ingredients such as formaldehyde) are safe. And in fact, that is what I did do in that forum. People asked questions, I answered them. I didn't get upset about the fact that some people disagreed. Because I am confident in the evidence that I have. Why is it that she isn't?

I don't know how to make this more clear....

It's not that people disagree. I EXPECT them to disagree. I fully understand not everyone is going to have the same opinion I do. I also fully understand there will be those who just WILL NEVER see things from my perspective. It's HOW they disagree. When people start talking down to others, THAT is where the problem comes in. And while it may not have been meant by most (excluding Sypha Belnades), it DID come across that way.

And RedFraggle, you have the wrong person. Obviously you now know Jodi was speaking of myself, NOT the person who posted the news article.

It didn't even cross my mind that she was talking about you because I thought you had thicker skin than to get upset by someone asking for some evidence of your 'research'.

What you have to understand is that if you're going to go into a public forum and admit to willingly be putting your children at risk of diseases which could kill or seriously disable them (and there is no denying that diseases like measles and meningitis, which includes haemophilus, DO do just that), AND claim to have made this decision based on extensive research, you HAVE to expect that someone is going to ask about your sources!

Because A LOT of the information that is out there is sinply untrue, but people don't realise that. So obviously in a discussion about vaccines people are going to ask you about your sources. How else can you justify the risk that you're putting your children at?

And anyway, I was entirely polite to you in that forum (although you got angry with Sypha, with good reason, but decided to attack ME for it!). All I did was ask questions, and asking questions is not the same as putting someone down. Perhaps if you'd answered them I could actually have learned something! Of course when some poor sources of information, and incorrect information (such as what Blogger said about formaldehyde and other ingredients) were produced, I explained why that information is false.

I asked about the person you know who was cured of diabetes by 'natural' methods... I got no answer. You mentioned some 'study' which showed that people live to 100 years old if they haven't been vaccinated... I asked for this study... you didn't reply. Just because something is a 'study' doesn't mean it's results are correct (and in fact anyone with any sense wouldn't choose life expectancy as a measure of effectiveness or risks of vaccines, because life expectancy is subject to SOOOO many other variables). You have to have the ability to assess the merits of the study... for example is it asking the right question (i.e. the relevance to the discussion... for example, life expectancy is not particularly helpful when talking about vaccines), what sort of numbers were looked at, was there any bias, was it a randomised controlled trial, etc etc. Many people just aren't able to do that. So saying you read something somewhere means absolutely nothing unless you can back it up with GOOD evidence.

And my previous comments still stand, if you really have so much evidence that has brought you to this decision, it should be easy for you to produce it, and if it's such good evidence you should have no reason NOT to produce it, because if good evidence, then there will be nothing I could say to dispute it. And I do have to wonder if your inability to produce those sources, and getting so upset about this is because the evidence you have isn't actually all that convincing. :P

I believe I have offended Lavender Breeze and I am going to publicly apologize for offending her. I stand by what I said, but I am sorry that it hurt her feelings.

The reason I did not post the name of the person was so that I could keep some anonymity to the situation. Not posting her name actually did not make people infer that it was her which was, in a way, protecting her. I discuss people many times without mentioning names in the forums, as do other people.

I don't feel I was talking behind her back. Everything I posted in the forums I said to her, and then I also posted it in a public forum. Neither of those things would I consider behind someone's back.

I did not feel I was representing her by mentioning her. I am not here TO represent her. I represent only myself and my opinions on this site.

Lavender Breeze, I am sorry if I have offended you by mentioning you. I am also sorry that you are disappointed in me as your friend for mentioning you in the forums, even if not by direct name. I can understand why you feel the way that you do and I did not meant to cause you any distress. I wish that we could have discussions and debates on any and every topic without you becoming so upset about them. Nobody is attacking you, and I am sorry that you feel that way.

Was this meant to be a reply to me??

I don't see why she should be hurt. It doesn't matter you're her friend or not, you're entitled to your own opinions. And you did maintain her anonymity. I thought you were talking about Blogger!

If she's so sensitive, and gets upset so easily perhaps she should just stay out of the forums.

I thought you had thicker skin than to get upset by someone asking for some evidence of your 'research'.

As I said, and it's the last time I'll state it because if you can't get it by now, you won't: I don't care about anyone asking for research (though my research has more to do with the reliability of the organizations and governments funding the research than it does about the vaccines themselves), I don't care about anyone disagreeing with me. It's when people get uppity and superior that I have the problem. And whether you see it or not, it was seen that you were beginning to get arrogant, as were others. Which is why I left when I did. I felt it was just better to let it go at that point and let you think whatever you wanted to think about my opinion and research.

As for the question about the diabetes, I did not see the question. I'm sorry I missed it.

I'm only responding to these two response to what I said and then I'm unsubscribing (or whatever the heck it's called) from this thread and won't be back. I have much more important, problematic things to deal with right now than this. RedFraggle, if you still want whatever your question about the diabetes was answered, feel free to leave me a message and I'll get to it. But right now I don't have the time or strength to go out and look for those books and the research that I did about the organizations and governments right now. And unfortunately, I do not have a photographic memory that I can just recall stuff like that off the top of my head. I can remember the gyst of the information presented, but the source I can't recall even a week after reading it unless I write it down. I've moved so many times since then that my paper with the resources has gone missing. I'm sorry if that makes me or my sources seem unreliable to you.

And for the last time, I don't care if people disagree with me. I expect people to. I know there is never going to be someone who agrees with my every opinion. I know there will be some people who will never understand my perspective of an opinion, and people I won't be able to change the mind of. It's when people start getting arrogant about it that I have the problem. And it WAS there.

It's when people get uppity and superior that I have the problem.

Example please? I was perfectly polite to you the entire time in that forum. When scientifically incorrect information (I can't remember know what was posted by you and what was posted by Blogger) was posted OF COURSE I disputed it. OF COURSE I provided counter arguments, with evidence, because that's what happens in a debate/discussion, particularly one on a subject such as vaccines! How exactly does that make someone arrogant or 'uppity and superior'?

And if you are going to say that you think statistics on life expectancy produced by WHO (and note, statistics produced NOT IN ANY RELATION TO ANY PRO-VACCINE CAMPAIGN) can't be trusted, you have to expect people to question that. Because WHO are an international organisation who work to help the health of the people of the world. They are not the government, they are not related to pharmaceutical companies. And if you're going to express a distrust for the World Health Organisation, people ARE going to question it, because most people are not so paranoid. That does not mean they are arrogant... just realistic.

I don't see why you need to do any research on the diabetes thing. From the way you were talking it sounded like someone you knew, so surely you could quite easily tell us more.

I can't believe that you can't remember ANY of your sources, given that you've read SO much evidence that shows vaccines to be unsafe.

I don't care about anyone asking for research (though my research has more to do with the reliability of the organizations and governments funding the research than it does about the vaccines themselves)

And so the studies you read which showed vaccines to be unsafe... they were produced by UNBIASED organisations were they? They weren't produced by anti-vaccination groups? And how assessed each one to be a GOOD study (in terms of the points I mentioned before, numbers etc). Well, if you do ever find the time to find them, I'd be genuinely interested for the references. Because despite much searching I have never found such studies.

^ This is why I come to the forums...

DRAMALLAMAZLOLZERZOMGWTFBBQ?!!!

I always knew you were a drama queen.

I just like observing human behavior. Internet forums are notorious for people exhibiting the worst behavior possible, due to relative anonymity and the removed threat of violence. (For instance, if someone went off on me in person with insults, there's a good chance they'd be minus a few teeth.)

If you don't like the way people talk/respond/react, don't read. It is honestly THAT simple. It is none of their business what you do, no matter if they disagree. But that won't stop people. If you don't want to be affected by it, disassociate yourself. If you aren't reading it, or paying attention to it, then you can't get upset by it.