There's no such thing as a reliable source. Only opinions, and shared opinions, from the educated, and not so educated. wiki reflects the opinions. If you think the the majority of an educated society that wiki reflects is wrong about something in the opinions of others. Prove your case on the topic at hand, not spout off nonsense red herring ignore the topic crapola

research: lt. ehren watada

and then come back here and tell us all how the thousands of people that wiki uses for their sources are wrong. lol

mm idk I kinda agree about not using wiki to site.

all wiki is a compilation of sources
wiki isn't the source it's self
it just list tons of sources and what they say for each topic
often it list sources that argue all sides of the arguments
and wiki always list the sources at the bottom of the page, and leaves numbers in the articles to show where each thing being said came from.

It's just an over view of the sources and the claims

cite! damnit.

Seriously, "sauce" you have done nothing in this thread but spread ignorant propaganda and show the blooping community that you have absolutely no life. This is not coming from someone with any type of military affiliation what-so-ever either. But on a lighter note, if you really want to do something about it that won't fall on deaf ears, run for office and voice your opionion in a truly public matter. And fyi, thousands of morons on wiki can and have been wrong before. I can go post to wiki right now that the sky is purple and is falling towards earth at an alarming rate and within a short time frame will have thousands of cited sources on wiki screaming to the high heavens that I am right, because there are millions of sheep just like you roaming this world. You even phrase your sentences using words you only know a half meaning of in hopes that society will lash out in anger rather than investigate your moronic claims, ahh for it to be the 60's again... the time when the government handled idiots like you.

Seriously, "sauce" you have done nothing in this thread but spread ignorant propaganda and show the blooping community that you have absolutely no life.

---My facts all check out. period. You wont debate the actual facts, because you are a Laaa Hoo Serrr.


This is not coming from someone with any type of military affiliation what-so-ever either.


--who you, or me? or who fucking cares if one is in the military or not. The military doesnt teach it's trained killers about illegal occupations, and or history- the untold history. As I've already mentioned on this thread, twice, now three times for you the idiot- I have family that has fought in every war since WW2


But on a lighter note, if you really want to do something about it that won't fall on deaf ears, run for office and voice your opinion in a truly public matter.

--Typical! You regurgitate what someone else has already said in this very same thread, moron.
I'm pushing for ALL OF US to be able to vote on the issues, not just have politicians make all the decisions for you, fucktard. I have left the link over and over [vote.org] that explains how this can be done, to have a true democracy, not a failed republic of trusting only POLITICIANS. We can take part in governing ourselves with national initiatives, do you want a voice that counts, or are you happy being the sheep that only trusts POLUITCIANS to make all desions for you. Judging by your asinine ignorant comment, I say you are happy being a do nothing SHEEP! ba ba ba

And fyi, thousands of morons on wiki can and have been wrong before. I can go post to wiki right now that the sky is purple and is falling towards earth at an alarming rate and within a short time frame will have thousands of cited sources on wiki screaming to the high heavens that I am right, because there are millions of sheep just like you roaming this world.

--If you think you can post on wiki and have it say what you just said. and not have it removed for being a total bullshit lie, with no sources to back it up, you are fooling yourself.
Yes, wiki had problems in the past with dumb asses like you that like to make up total bullshit. But that's not the case anymore. YOU cant post in wiki, and if you do, it has to be approved first. and you have to have sources. Let me explain how wiki works, for you retarded fucks.
When I cite wiki, I'm not citing the website wiki, wiki is not the source, it's just a website where is compiled what sources have to say on w/e the topic is, most often wiki puts up each side of the a story, but if you go to the bottom of the page, wiki list each source. idiot
exmp: I left a wiki link to the Lt. Watada story, wiki it's self is NOT the source you fucking RETARD, for exmp for his Lt Watada's story wiki used these sources:

^ Initial video statement of Lt. Ehren Watada June 6, 2006
^ Army lieutenant who won’t go to Iraq issues recorded statement
^ a b Soldier's Iraq war stance backed: Watada has right to refuse to go, retired officer says, Seattle Post-Intelligencer, June 20, 2006.
^ a b Order Granting in Part Petitioner's Motion for a Stay of Court Martial Proceedings dated 5 October, 2007, Tacoma, Washington Federal District case no. C07-5549BHS
^ a b "Watada Won't Be Retried on 3 of 5 Counts" (Seattle Times)
^ International Day of Action to Support First Lt. Ehren Watada
^ Officer at Fort Lewis calls Iraq war illegal, refuses order to go
^ Instead of Iraq, a battle all his own
^ Security Council Resolution 1511, October 16, 2003.
^ a b c Officer faces court-martial for refusing to deploy, The New York Times, July 23 2006.
^ a b Deployment Refuser has no Regrets, Army Times, June 14, 2006.
^ a b First Officer Announces Refusal to Deploy to Iraq, Truthout.org, June 7 2006.
^ Army Charges Lieutenant With Contempt and Conduct Unbecoming an Officer for Refusing Iraq Deployment and Criticizing Bush, War, Democracy Now, July 7 2006.
^ a b c Hearings to open on 'no Iraq' officer: Fort Lewis panel to decide if Watada faces court-martial, Seattle Post-Intelligencer, August 17, 2006.
^ a b c Hearing for soldier who won't serve in Iraq puts war on trial Seattle Post Intelligencer, August 18, 2006.
^ Military uses video of Watada speeches as evidence against him The Olympian, August 17, 2006.
^ Lt. Watada addresses national veterans convention thankyoult.org
^ ACLU Defends Free Speech Rights of Lt. Ehren Watada, "ACLU", August 15, 2005.
^ Investigator recommends court martial on all charges, thankyoult.org
^ t r u t h o u t | Perspective Truthout.org, August 14, 2006.
^ a b Lieutenant Watada Faces New Charges, Truthout.org, September 18, 2006.
^ "Lieutenant Watada Faces New Charges" By Sarah Olson, 18 September 2006
^ Fort Lewis soldier opposed to war faces military trial, The Seattle Times, November 10, 2006.
^ a b It was My Duty to Refuse to go to Iraq The Daily Telegraph, November 23, 2006.
^ Judge John M. Head (January 16, 2007). "Ruling of the Court: Defense Request for Hearing on Nuremberg Defense". http://peacelaw.wikidot.com/local--files/2007-01-30/2007-01-16-rules. Retrieved on January 30 2007.
^ Judge John M. Head (January 16, 2007). "Ruling of the Court: Defense Motion to Suppress the Charge and All Specifications Alleging Violations of Article 133". http://peacelaw.wikidot.com/local--files/2007-01-30/2007-01-16-speech. Retrieved on January 30 2007.
^ Officer facing Court-Martial Denounces War, "Los Angeles Times," January 17, 2007.
^ Not-guilty plea in court-martial Los Angeles Times, February 6, 2007.
^ Army: War Objector Brought Disgrace Forbes.com, February 6, 2007.
^ a b Army: Watada betrayed trust Seattle Times, February 7, 2007.
^ Mistrial ends Watada court-martial: War objector may have to be tried again, Seattle Post-Intelligencer, February 7, 2007.
^ "US war objector's trial misfires". BBC. 2007-02-07. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6340897.stm. Retrieved on 2007-02-07.
^ Melanthia Mitchell (2007-05-19). "Court issues stay in Watada court-martial". Associated Press. http://www.armytimes.com/news/2007/05/ap_watada_warobjector_070519/. Retrieved on 2007-05-21.
^ "Watada switches lawyers for second court-martial". Associated Press. 2007-04-06. http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003654034_watada06m.html. Retrieved on 2007-04-06.
^ Mike Barber (2007-02-09). "Army expects to retry Watada". Seattle Post-Intelligencer. http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/303085_watadaweb09.html. Retrieved on 2007-05-21.
^ Manual of Courts-Martial United States (2005 Edition) PDF document.
^ Jeff Paterson, "Lt. Watada Mistrial Clear Victory," Courage to Resist, February 8, 2007.
^ "Justice Department won't pursue war objector case". Associated Press. 7 May 2008. http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5gjsmj3UMnLWTsbnt3Th9Fs70UtDgD9811L401.
^ "Watada lawyer frustrated as judge narrows defense" Seattle Post-Intelligencer, February 6, 2007.
^ Military veterans stand behind "illegal war" refuser, August 14, 2006.
^ Loyal to Country or Conscience?, "Los Angeles Times", October 16, 2006.
^ "28 arrested in San Francisco as Watada faces pre-trial hearing in Ft. Lewis, WA.". January 9, 2007. http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2007/01/09/18345188.php. Retrieved on January 15 2007.
^ War Objector's 'Freedom of Conscience Must Be Respected,' Asserts Amnesty International, Amnesty International Press Release retrieved from CommonDreams.org
^ Military Families Rebuke Army Lt. for Refusal to Serve and Alliance with Anti-American Groups, Military Families Voice of Victory, June 7, 2006.
^ Japanese Americans, Latest Group to Criticize Watada, KHNL 8, July 15, 2006.
^ WORLD CAN'T WAIT--DRIVE OUT THE BUSH REGIME
^ Father becomes outspoken critic of Iraq war
^ Beth Freed (2006-11-07). "Paternal Pride: Father Delivers Army Son’s Anti-War Message Nationwide". Lone Star Iconoclast. http://www.lonestaricon.com/absolutenm/anmviewer.asp?a=734&z=79. Retrieved on 2007-05-22.
^ SoCal events with Bob Watada underway, thankyoult.org
^ "Citizens' hearing on the legality of U.S. actions in Iraq: The Case of Lt. Ehren Watada". January 20, 2007. http://www.wartribunal.net/. Retrieved on July 14 2007.


50 fucking sources, with even more links on the same topic. duh.com you stupid shit!
wiki is just a compilation of popular sources for each topic, if a claim is disputed wiki says so.
The reason many schools dont allow wiki, is because they want you to do what wiki has done and use many many sources for your claim, not take the easy way out and let wiki do all the work for you. I post wiki links because you get all sides and the sources are always listed, or else it says "citation needed" well, i personally dont really post anything that cant be cited. all you retards had to do was scroll your lazy asses down to the bottom of wiki and see what sources are being used. fucking IDIOT!


You even phrase your sentences using words you only know a half meaning of in hopes that society will lash out in anger rather than investigate your moronic claims, ahh for it to be the 60's again... the time when the government handled idiots like you.


---More moronic gibberish from you that amounts to nothing but a derange fool banging pots and pans together, it's very comical. I dont expect you to understand what a true democracy is. I do expect you to not look into anything yourself, and I do expect you to want only politicians to make all the decisions for you, bec you, like most americans, are a lazy dumb fuck, that is more interested in trash, then you are in taking OUT the trash.

If you dont want to debate the topics, and only want to talk shit like a predictable idiot "sheep"
dont waste my time with your petty gobbleygook. I laugh at fools like you!!

NEXT!

The 60's again? You mean when the government set forth troops against students protesting an unjust war to fight the Soviets by proxy? You mean, when they disproportionately sent black Americans to the warzone to die for a country that pretty clearly had no love for them? I'm not sure what you mean by the government "handling idiots" in the 60's, but I assure you, it was a bad time for free speech, and a very bad time for human rights.

Or maybe you mean the tail-end of McCarthyism, with blacklisting and finger-pointing (though more from the 50s.)

If you think Big Brother should "handle" difficult, opinionated citizens, you are indeed quite the idiot.

You can still support the troops without supporting the war... they don't choose to be there... they get sent there under orders.

They knew what they were getting into when they enlisted. We don't have a draft anymore; they volunteered. They're not innocent victims or whatever here, they're active participants.

They did not volunteer for an illegal war that goes against everything this country stands for.

a few naive idiots that are just some dumb young kids that got sucked into media brain washing might have signed up to murder people. that's who you support- the scum at the bottom of the barrel

That's like saying I support toes, but dont support feet.

I so did not want to get on this thread.

But since it's already been mentioned... Did anyone see this article on CNN??

A U.S. soldier convicted of murdering an Iraqi family spoke out for the first time Thursday, issuing a public apology for his crimes.

Thanks for that. I didnt know he made an apology. That was actually one of teh cases that i did remember, and mentioned without the details. I had knew he raped a 12 or 14 yr old and killed her whole family, and made them watch it all. His life is ruined, the Iraqis reject the apology bec sorry doesnt bring lives back.

Green was found guilty in U.S. District Court in Kentucky of raping a 14-year-old girl and murdering her, her parents and her 6-year-old sister in the town of Yusufiya, about 20 miles south of Baghdad, in 2006.

I want the people of bloop to read that^^ and read it good, for that is not an isolated incident, he's just one of the few that got caught amongst the wide spread rapping of women and children that went on in Iraq.

perhaps we should teach bloopers about Depleted Uranium as well

bump diz

Yeah, we could talk about the Depleted Uranium. Ha. I just don't want to see any more "9/11 was an inside job" videos. They totally used to crash my computer!

Our soldiers in Vietnam did some of the same things - raping and murdering people. But that does not mean that every single soldier does this. But people who think that it does not happen are naive. They don't see it because they don't want to see it - not because it's not happening!

It is the same thing as in our country - not every single person in the country is a rapist or murderer, but there are people who do it. With as many troops as we have it's not that hard to realize that some of them would be doing these things. Hell, military people on bases in America get in trouble for raping people, beating their own wives, etc. There is a lot of pent up anger and rage in military people. We teach them to kill - it's not a stretch to think that they might actually kill. lol.

The title of the thread was meant to elicit a response from people because seeing it makes people want to click on it and leave a response. Tommy merely wanted to get as many people here as possible but his point seems to be that we should not support what the troops are doing in Iraq & Afghanistan or the "War on Terror", should certainly not support those soldiers who ARE doing things that are wrong in Iraq, and shouldn't encourage anyone to enlist in the military while the "war" is going on because it gives the appearance to the Government & those who wanted the "war" that one AGREES with the war if he/she is willing to sign up now - knowing they'll probably have to fight in this war and be killed for something that they may not support at all. I don't think that he means we should hate every single person in the military right now because as he said, he comes from a military family, and when a war is "just" then people should be enlisting and everyone should support the "war".

you know me so well it's kinda freaky ;D

LOL. It comes from knowing you - and debating you - for like 7 YEARS, dude! LOL.

Though it is still funny to see you pissing everyone off because they don't "get" what you're doing.

uhhhh how did I not know (or even ever hear of) you or Tommy in the past 7 years?!

I don't know how you didn't know of us. We've been around since Bloop first started. We both came from InTheWire, I believe... That's when I came over anyway, sometime around 2002, I think... Bloop is still the BEST!

I don't think the 'troops' can be blamed.
You sign up to 'protect' your country with all good intentions. But then you have to go where you are sent.
Your argument against the war is entirely valid - it is a STUPID excuse to go after oil, while pretending to be Looking For Osama
But the men fighting it, however one-sided the fighting may be, are obeying orders.
And while you may be a pacifist who cannot understand why anyone would sign up to fight a war, just remember that without armed forces, a free existence would not be possible. Perhaps these days we don't really NEED armed forces, but we certainly have in the past. They cannot be entirely disregarded and classified useless.
I'm British by the way and resent being told to keep out of it as it's America's war. British forces are over there, sent by a stupid alliance with America.
Who ordained America Guardians of the Universe?

I don't think the 'troops' can be blamed.

--cant have an illegal war if no one shows up to fight it


You sign up to 'protect' your country with all good intentions.



--good intentions pave the road to hell (The US has a military budget the size for world wide conquest, america is extremely violent, look at the number of deaths each yr from guns, that's if we dont run you over with our multiple cars first, there's 600 million of us, only fools would invade us, they would never win, no one will nuke us, bec we can nuke them right back so there's nothing to gain, putting money into a missile defense system is great, but must be done only here in the US, not Poland, and in the open waters on our Navy ships, we here at home can protect ourselves, our streets are flooded with guns, from the military industrial complex- weapons manufacturers. our citizens are armed to the teeth, and so is are military here, no one will ever invade us, ever.-again,lol damn u red coats




But then you have to go where you are sent.


--actually you dont. You have the right to refuse an illegal order. and it's your moral duty as an american sworn to protect the laws of the constitution/bill of rights, not break the very backbone that the misinformed think they're fighting for, when in reality they're fighting against the very foundation of this country.



Your argument against the war is entirely valid - it is a STUPID excuse to go after oil, while pretending to be Looking For Osama


--Last time I checked the US is not getting any Iraqi oil. It was never a war for the actual physical oil, we have plenty of our own oil. But rather a war for what the oil was being sold with, not to mention war profiteering, you see there's a thing called OPEC oil rich countries that sign onto OPEC sell oil with the US dollar, this is how foreign countries can get something they need, for the US dollars they get stuck with from all the imports that we buy in unbalanced trade agreements. By using US dollars to buy oil with, this removes some of the 4 trillion in trade deficits the US has that's being carried by US bonds and treasury notes from countries like China, Japan, Taiwan, India, Mexico, where we buy our products from them... and give only a paper IOU, well they can buy oil with that, and this takes off the debt to keep our dollar value a float, so as not to cause us an enormous inflation rise for having to much debt in unblanaced trading deficits. They get to buy some oil, but have to use our dollar. Countries that refuse to do this, to us this is seen as an act of financial warfare, one that we protect with military might ie Saddam went off the US dollar and switch to the Error and we attacked Iraq, and now Iraq sells oil to china and this removes some the trillion dollar debt we owe china for their products and this keeps our dollar value up, and inflation down.
(keep in mind Iran went off the US dollar in 06 as was promised yrs b4, and now we have them in our sights even more, using Israel as the proxy)


But the men fighting it, however one-sided the fighting may be, are obeying orders.


--You know the Nazis tried that same line when we hunted them down and tried them in the nuremberg trials for war crimes, it didn't fly then, and it doesnt fly now. This war is illegal, and participating in it makes you an exsesery to a crime, which happen to be punishable by law.


And while you may be a pacifist who cannot understand why anyone would sign up to fight a war,


-I'm no pacifist. I just happen to know that if one can fly a plane into a building here, some rogue terroist group that doesnt like us having military bases on their land, killing their people, and supplying Israel with WMDs, nukes, helicopters, tanks, money, technology, despite Israel attacking all of her neighbors and continuing to expand her borders each and every year, forcing the Palestinians off of their land that can be described as none other than ethnic cleansing, all because the bible says jews are god's chosen people and they need to have all of Palestine in order for the US a christian nation to get their jesus to come back. oh wait, that's just all bs to get this christian nation to support the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians, whom they call "less than dogs" In reality america stands up for countries being attacked like Palestine and Lebanon, ohhhh oops I forgot, this is some twilight zone whereas america calls the extremely poor countries being invaded by their big bully neighbors- the "terroist". God forbid the "terrorist" ever open their eyes up to what's going on in their neighborhood, where they live, why...they might fly a plane into us. Only thing is, we have agents all over the world, we have sniper teams that can take out anyone, anywhere. Our technology is seconded to none. We have special op teams that can get anyone, anywhere. We'd just rather blow your whole country up and force you to be like us, because of the acts of a handful that aren't even from your country. We dont even care that the geneva convention says collective punishment of a whole country for the acts of a few is illegal and a crime. We laugh at the rules we make and break. but will attack anyone that breaks the rules that we ourselves break.

just remember that without armed forces, a free existence would not be possible. Perhaps these days we don't really NEED armed forces, but we certainly have in the past. They cannot be entirely disregarded and classified useless.


--We fought and stole this land by force, we're not going anywhere, no one can defeat us, no one is a threat to us, we have the might to conquer the world, and we think we can do it. We already have all your central banks tied to us, our economy effects yours and the worlds. We are the virus, and the only cure, is ironically- us. Most of us dont want to kill anyone, it's just that our TV tells us; that if anyone looks different than us, talks different than us, or god forbid calls the same jewish god as ours a different name than us, bec they speak another language, why surely...... they hate our freedumb and want to kill us, I saw it on television, so it must be true. right?



I'm British by the way and resent being told to keep out of it as it's America's war. British forces are over there, sent by a stupid alliance with America.
Who ordained America Guardians of the Universe?


--you live on a little tiny island. we own you. what can you do about that? j/k ;D
the british live in 1984
big brother is watching your every move
your TV says muslim want to kill you
protect yourself by turn off the TV
and passing out newspapers from San Franscisco, and NY

"protect yourself by turning off the TV and passing out newspapers from SF and NY"?????

LMAO. That was funny.

I figured you would go into the whole "the world made the USA guardians of the universe, don't you know that everyone comes to us when they need help and money and protection..."

LOL!!

Michael Hudson wrote a book called "The Myth of Aid" (1971)
and in that book he says something like;
'How do you get control of a foreign bank?
'you give them your money (fiat paper debt)